Mastering Recruiter Productivity with Brad Wolff

Intro [00:00:00]:
Welcome to the elite recruiter podcast with your host, Benjamin Menna, where we focus on what it takes to win in the recruiting game. We cover it all from sales, marketing, mindset, money, leadership, and placements.

Benjamin Mena [00:00:20]:
Before we get started with this episode of the Elite Recruiter podcast, I just wanna say thank you guys. The recruiting growth summit is next week, March 4th through March 8th. And when I originally put it together, I was gonna be ecstatic if 25 people showed up or 25 people registered. As of the time of this recording, over 250 people have registered for it. So I just wanna say thank you, guys. I am so excited for you guys to hear these incredible speakers. It is I know 2023 has been a rough year for many people, but I really believe that for many of you guys, 2024 is gonna be your best year yet. So thank you guys for registering.

Benjamin Mena [00:01:05]:
It's gonna be awesome next week, and I am nervous and excited at the same time. So back to the podcast. I'm excited about this episode of the elite recruiter podcast. Main reason is, have you ever gotten to the end of your day, sat down, look at what you did, and realize that you'd haven't done a fucking thing? It is one of the problems in recruiting is we're constantly, like, running around like firefighters. We're constantly putting out fires, but so often, we're not in control of our day. And because we're not in control of our day, we are not getting the things done that it takes to make the placement and takes to get the money. And so not having control of your day impacts your income and your family's income. That's why I'm excited about my guest today, Brad Wolf.

Benjamin Mena [00:01:49]:
We're gonna talk about productivity when it comes to recruiting. We're gonna talk about the secrets of being able to stay on track so that way you can make more placements. So excited, Brad, to have you to the podcast. Welcome.

Brad Wolff [00:02:01]:
Thank you, Benjamin. Really, honored to be a guest on your podcast.

Benjamin Mena [00:02:05]:
Thank thank you so much. So we before we do a deep dive on making yourself the most productive recruiter you could be, how the hell did you even end up in the wonderful world of recruiting?

Brad Wolff [00:02:15]:
So actually I I started off as an accountant. I became a CPA, believe it or not, but that was Cheap. Like a lousy account.

Benjamin Mena [00:02:23]:
Too into the spectrum, like people and numbers.

Brad Wolff [00:02:27]:
It it's it's life is what happens in life is often more interesting than a movie that, a fictional movie. So then I went into selling insurance and Okay. Investments, and I did that for about five and a half years. And then I really was kinda like, no. I don't wanna sell insurance. I like being in sales, etcetera. And this is back in the 2 that I was kind of at a crossroads and wasn't sure what I wanted to do. I knew I didn't wanna be an accountant, but I didn't wanna sell insurance.

Brad Wolff [00:02:58]:
And back 1 92, when you're looking for a job, it was the classified job ads that came out on Sunday, and it was in the AJC Atlanta Journal Constitution. And I saw an ad, and literally it said, looking for a CPA with a sales background. I mean, which is kind of a ridiculous advertisement. So I was like, what's

Benjamin Mena [00:03:21]:
the point?

Brad Wolff [00:03:23]:
I mean, there was probably one applicant that was qualified and are few in the whole regional area. So I applied to interview it and got the job, not too surprisingly. So, that's how I got into Recredit and just took off from there. And I oh, and I started off placing accounting and financial people. That was the, other piece where why they wanted someone that had an accounting background.

Benjamin Mena [00:03:48]:
So, I mean, at least like you knew the industry and it's kind of crazy, like, you know, job ad looking for an accountant with a sales background. Boom. There you go. Welcome to recruiting. And it's been, you know, looking at your background on LinkedIn and the discussion that we've had, you've had an incredible journey. Talk about that.

Brad Wolff [00:04:05]:
So the first 10 years I worked for 2 large national recruiting firms where quite frankly, I got great training and worked with some terrific people. So it really, was a great breeding ground for me to succeed. And I did really well, and I loved it. Making a lot of money. This is pre Internet, pre all the stuff that we do now. And it was a different world. I loved it, thrived. And then in 2001, we hit the, dotcominternetbubble recession.

Brad Wolff [00:04:42]:
And I realized that was a good time to start my own firm because I wasn't walking away from a lot. I was making very good money and it was harder to walk away then. So when things went south, it was much easier. So I became a cofounder in a firm, started off placing the accounting financial people because the firm I was at was placing IT professionals, both contract and direct hire. That we built a firm for about 7 years, and then, long story, I don't wanna get into all the details. We started a new firm with a different model. And quite frankly, in 2017, I realized, you know, I'm not excited. I it's become repetitive for me.

Brad Wolff [00:05:24]:
Mhmm. You know, after 25 years and 15 years of being an owner, founder, and having a team, It was a lot of the same things over and over. And I realized that I was really what I really was juiced up about was training development, coming up with processes and tools and solutions, all of those things, and not the day to day brand recruiting business, which became repetitive. So I earned my coaching certification and decided to become a coach and advisor. It was like, okay, you know, I'm getting to a point in my life. It's kind of like my last career. And I didn't wanna I wanted to do something different that I was excited about. So I launched and I realized my audience very clearly were founders of small and midsize recruiting firm, because I sat in their seat, walked in their shoes, dealt with the same issues they deal with.

Brad Wolff [00:06:22]:
And it was a natural fit. And then that's what I've been doing since 2018.

Benjamin Mena [00:06:26]:
And that that is, like, one of the things that you sometimes see with, like, sometimes coaches is you see the coaches that have learned the industry, and then you see the coaches that have done something for 25 years know the ups and downs have sat in the seat and they're like, let me here's the roadmap that I used. Absolutely.

Brad Wolff [00:06:43]:
So it's been a great fit. I love what I do. I really enjoy working very closely with founders, and I work with their teams too. I'll do training with the teams on topics. Some of my clients have me train the you know, work with the team on productivity issues. And what happens what's what happened that caused me to really put a major focus on productivity? A few things. Number 1, I saw again and again where people knew what to do, but they weren't putting it into action. They weren't executed.

Brad Wolff [00:07:17]:
Number 2, I looked at the mirror and realized the host of productivity problems I had with distractibility, shiny objects, emotional ups and downs, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. I'd really took an honest look at my life. And probably about 10 years ago, realized, man, productivity is a real problem for me. It's, you know, when I really get in a role and I'm focused on something, I can do great, but I get off target, all these things, yep, that we talk about. So I really became somewhat obsessed. Yeah. I'm gonna use the word obsessed instead of selling. And I really did a tremendous amount of research, took courses, psychology, brain science, really getting to the heart of what allows people to be effective and and execute versus not so effective and not executing.

Brad Wolff [00:08:14]:
And it wasn't how smart they were. It wasn't their knowledge or skills often. It was the ability to stay focused and follow through on what matters most. With about 10 years of research, training, working with clients, I realized that this is a missing piece in the industry. And most people just don't directly talk about it. They'll talk about little specific issues. You know, I have a hard time staying on track. I'm overwhelmed.

Brad Wolff [00:08:45]:
I'm just not in the mood on and on and on. I just can't seem to follow through. I got off on a tangent, all these things, but they don't put it together and say, these are all part of one big puzzle that you can group into a classification called productivity. Mhmm. So that's what we're excited about this is this really is a missing piece that few people are talking about, and it isn't solved with the traditional methods. Well, if you had a good to do list and you planned your day. Well, if you simply just blocked out time. Well, if there's the tools and technology more effectively, that that wasn't solving the issues.

Brad Wolff [00:09:22]:
I don't see people solving the issues with that for a number of years. So I realized it's a much bigger puzzle than what most people think.

Benjamin Mena [00:09:31]:
And it's, it's kind of like looking back on my recruiting career and, you know, I started in the early 2 or the mid 2000. And there wasn't the massive amount of distractions like I'd way before email sequences. But then you like, you look at today and like, you know, you have to like write a good story on LinkedIn. So you spend time doing that. And then you spend time getting stuck in somebody else's stories, like, and then you're like, you, like, gotta post an Instagram or TikTok and 45 minutes later, you're still on TikTok. You know, this little Pado Padomo Tyber, like saves you half the time, your to do list. Like it just, I think that the problem is, and I'm excited about you bringing, talking about this on the podcast is we live in a different world. We live in a world that's full of noise and that noise at the end of the day, there's a lot of recruiters that are probably looking up and I can actually measure out only an hour or 2 of pro productivity out of an 8 or 10 hour day.

Benjamin Mena [00:10:35]:
So let's talk about, like, first of all, how do you recognize that you're being distracted before we start talking about how to fix that?

Brad Wolff [00:10:44]:
Well, I think there's a few clues then I took great extent people realize they're being distracted, but that just becomes a habit and they don't think they they don't, it doesn't draw a lot of attention. You're jumping from task to task and you're not staying focused on one thing. That's a sign of distraction. You're always chasing something that's in your face. So the recruiting industry productivity is more difficult than most industries because most industries don't have the constant level of interruptions, constant changes in direction, constant ups and downs with things blowing up, despite every you're doing everything right. So that's why it was so important to design a course and training around the specific issues related to recruiting that are difficult so that people, recruiters can address the challenges to their productivity rather than something generic. But I got off on a tangent with Tom at the the. I wanted to give you a good example of distractibility so you can know that it was you can point at and and identify.

Brad Wolff [00:11:50]:
You're not staying focused on one thing at a time, and you're constantly moving around and you're allowing yourself to be interrupted. And you're open. You're you're you're you're an open invitation to interruptions. Those are some clues. And I don't find many recruiters that don't have a problem with that, Frankly, it's

Benjamin Mena [00:12:09]:
like the occasion. I think the only people that I I've seen that haven't had a huge distraction issue are some of the, the top billers that have really figured out how to like block out everything.

Brad Wolff [00:12:23]:
You know what, Benjamin, That's one of the things I learned is also I took a look at what is it about people that are consistently the most productive recruiters and what are they doing? And there's some common threats. Certainly, there's individual differences, but there's also common threats. And what you just said is one of the common threats. But here's the catch. There's personality characteristics that make it a lot easier for some people just to block out time and tune out distractions That most people, that's not how they're wired, so they've gotta come up with other ways to deal with it. For example, I'm just going to give you an example. I remember back when I was selling insurance, one of the trainings we did is on productivity and walking out your day. And the training was, you know, someone went out their day in detail on their calendar from this time to this time, they do this.

Brad Wolff [00:13:15]:
And from this from this time to that time, they did that, etcetera. And I tried that. There's no effing way I was gonna do that. That was just so extreme for me, and I'd be like, even if I was productive, I'd be so pissed off all the time.

Benjamin Mena [00:13:30]:
I mean, talk about one of my favorite things I've seen at other industries where they're like, well, just like turn your email off until, like, after lunch. And I'm like, but we're recruiters. Like we live in our phone and email all day long. Like you explain, just what if I miss something? Well,

Brad Wolff [00:13:45]:
we can address that when you're red. Because that when I said re productivity in the recruiting industry is more difficult than almost every field I could think of. What you just said is one of the multiple reasons, and it's an addiction to constant news and constant updates.

Benjamin Mena [00:14:04]:
Okay. So we're right there. Like, let's talk about that then. Like, what are

Brad Wolff [00:14:07]:
the yeah.

Benjamin Mena [00:14:08]:
Let's focus on that. What are the re

Brad Wolff [00:14:10]:
So we go into there's brain science involved, and then I'll talk about also with this. The thing is every we all have myths that we buy into. And one of the biggest myths in the recruiting industry is you've got to always be accessible. You never know when a client or a candidate or a a coworker or this and that need you. Okay. So we really believe that, but here's the thing. If I'm your candidate and you're interviewing me for a job, are you taking phone calls?

Benjamin Mena [00:14:46]:
Okay. Point taken.

Brad Wolff [00:14:47]:
Are you checking your email and text? Point taken. Okay. So you're not when you're interviewing. Why is that?

Benjamin Mena [00:14:55]:
Because you're busy.

Brad Wolff [00:14:57]:
Because it's a priority. You you Yeah. Would be that would take you off target. Right? Mhmm.

Benjamin Mena [00:15:03]:
Okay.

Brad Wolff [00:15:03]:
Well, you just told me that it isn't true that you can't put aside time where you're not distracted. You just, you know, if someone's in business development, if they're on a client visit or a client call, are they taking other calls and emails and texts? Now if the answer is no, then you know it's bullshit. It's total bullshit, but we buy into it because it it it seems intuitively correct, but it's bullshit. That doesn't mean that you you should never be accessible. When you when you call a busy professional, say you call your doctor, do you expect them to answer the phone?

Benjamin Mena [00:15:38]:
They almost never answer the phone.

Brad Wolff [00:15:39]:
Do you expect them to return your email in 5 minutes?

Benjamin Mena [00:15:42]:
Not within 5 minutes.

Brad Wolff [00:15:43]:
Okay. Do you really think that your candidates and clients and coworkers need you and expect you to have nothing else going on that you just answer and put right away?

Benjamin Mena [00:15:55]:
Most of the time. Yeah. No. Point taken.

Brad Wolff [00:15:58]:
So it's an addiction that we have, and it's addict it's the same chemical addiction that social media plays on is we're always looking for that next quick hit of dopamine because it gets, it causes us to be, oh, great. And that they play on that. And it's the same thing. It's an addictive quality where we want the next hit of dopamine. And once we're addicted, we're always checking the phone and checking our email on this. And it because we feel like we have to, and it's it's we're just kidding ourselves. It's not true.

Benjamin Mena [00:16:28]:
So how do you change that?

Brad Wolff [00:16:29]:
So first of all, that's that's a great question. It's not I don't have a quick fix answer for any one thing because I don't think I pick the major challenges in life were answered with one quick fix. Number 1, you acknowledge that it's bullshit, that it's a story we tell ourselves. That's number 1. Number 2 is we don't expect perfection. So if you say, well, I'm going to block out these hours of time, and I'm going to turn my phone off and I'm not going to check my email and I'm not going to go on social media and all that. If you expect perfection, then as soon as you fall off the wagon, which you will, you're gonna say, what's the point? I can't do it. So you just say, I'm constantly looking to improve and minimize the distractions, but not totally eliminate.

Brad Wolff [00:17:21]:
It's not all or nothing. Number 3, you have realistic blocks of time. Let's say an hour where you have priority time where you really need to focus and not be distracted. You tell people on your team, look, Benjamin, in order to make sure that I could get things done that we need to, I'm gonna have blocks of time where I'm not interrupted, and I'll just let you know. So you realize I'm not ignored. Hey, everyone. Quite frankly, that's one of the best things leaders can do is they set the tone that this is what you do here. So you get work done.

Brad Wolff [00:17:53]:
Okay. And you treat it like an interview or a client visit or whatever else, and you put your phone on D and D or turn it off. Now someone says, what if it's an emergency? My wife calls, but that that that okay. You can program your DND so it only accepts calls from certain people. I'm expecting a client, but the client doesn't expect that you're gonna answer the phone. Right? That or the candidate. So you can just program it. I will allow these calls in.

Brad Wolff [00:18:20]:
Turn off your email notifications. If you're on the internet, you're only staying on the site that's relevant to you and they're not going to be hearing off. And you just say, I'm gonna stay focused and call and take my time because you need, you know, 10 minutes or so to get into the groove. When you start doing that, you don't just immediately shift into focus. You're you're you move in into focus with some time and you relax. Maybe you play some calming music without words, without lyrics, but you just say, this is quiet, calm, productive time. And you start actually liking when you do it because it's actually enjoyable. You you slow down.

Brad Wolff [00:19:03]:
That's another topic we can cover as though this whole myth about you you go faster to that. You wanna get more done. That's another bullshit myth that we've tended to buy.

Benjamin Mena [00:19:12]:
I mean, if you like talking about doing things faster, I actually have done this a few times. I used a website called toggle and I spent like a week or 2 weeks at a time. I do this a few times a year where I literally track everything I'm doing, like on a time basis and calculate it out. And one of the things that every time I do that, it really just makes me think like, look at like how many times I switch a task, how many times I am multitasking, and that toggle actually made me monotask a lot more.

Brad Wolff [00:19:42]:
Benjamin, that's a fantastic idea. It's to take an inventory. And here's the thing. Here's what I think is key for the listeners to realize. You don't beat yourself up because you're imperfect. Because that's that's another way to keep us off track as we say, oh, I can't do this. I'm such I'm so horrible at this. Oh, I I'm so disappointed myself and all the things we tell ourselves.

Brad Wolff [00:20:08]:
Because studying studies of psychology have clearly shown that actually lowers your, effectiveness, lowers your confidence. Because then it what it does is it gives you an excuse to let yourself off the hook and stop trying. It's another bullshit thing we do. You see, when you do something you feel bad about that, the easiest thing to do is to punish yourself by feeling bad, because then that avoids you from taking action to correct it. So we actually delude ourselves into thinking, feeling bad as a substitute for action. And it's not so feeling bad is the worst of you. Don't don't beat yourself. I'm I'm human.

Brad Wolff [00:20:45]:
I do all these things. I just set things up, so I do a lot less of it and feel a lot better about myself. But I slip. I just said, hey. That's what happens. Just get back on focus. I I I took this call when I said I wouldn't. Okay.

Brad Wolff [00:21:00]:
Fine. Okay. Let's just get back. Very calm. Okay, Brett. Let's just get back. No problem. Back on the wagon, fall off, get back on the wagon, fall off, get back on the wagon, and just and even laugh about it.

Brad Wolff [00:21:11]:
Don't take yourself too seriously with this. Have some fun.

Benjamin Mena [00:21:14]:
So, is there any other like issues that you see that before we go farther that you see as recruiting is different compared to other places that makes it so difficult.

Brad Wolff [00:21:25]:
Okay. We've talked about the cost and describing. I think we'd beat that when we're pretty early. Okay. I'm not gonna feel bad about being here though. So I'm gonna get back on the wagon. So the the the the another one is constant changes and shifts into. You're doing everything you can to get everything set up for, for a placement, for filling a job.

Brad Wolff [00:21:46]:
And then shit happens, which it will, all of a sudden, changing direction. Oh, the hiring manager is not gonna hire, or they promoted some. Oh, the candidate took another job or changed their mind On and on and on. So everything you're doing and you're working on and you're focused and that like that in an instant. Change again. Irrelevant. Move on. Okay.

Brad Wolff [00:22:12]:
The constant shifts in directions are a major distraction, and it's the emotional impact also on us. Quite frankly, when things blow up despite our best efforts, it's a punch in the gut. How do you feel when that happens? Happened? When you did everything right, it looked like a deal and then boom. Tell me tell me how you feel.

Benjamin Mena [00:22:32]:
Oh, it sucks. Like and it really depends. Like, sometimes it depends on the week, the month where you're at and how big the deal is. You're just like, well, shit. I it's it's 5 o'clock somewhere, even though it's 10 o'clock now. I'm like, you know what? It's time for wine or whiskey.

Brad Wolff [00:22:47]:
I mean, let's be real. So that's another one is emotional ups and downs. And so I've seen people lose weeks of productivity when a really disappointing event happened. And and here's the thing, Disappointing events happens in clusters that tell statistics work. So that's where the word cluster f comes around because you got cluster, and it just you're like, oh, no. And then the next thing happened. Here's the thing. It's the emotional ups and downs is another productivity killer.

Brad Wolff [00:23:14]:
So learning because it's specific techniques on how to deal with emotional ups and downs without it throwing you in a ditch and taking you, off target for a long time. So that's another difference in the recruiting industry. There's just more of these things because you're you're you're you're dealing with the the only product out there that has an opinion Okay. That can change its mind. Think about sales in every other field. What you're selling doesn't do shit. It does what you tell it to do.

Benjamin Mena [00:23:45]:
At the end of the day. Yeah.

Brad Wolff [00:23:47]:
So the that's another big piece that a lot of people don't wanna talk about is the emotional up and down piece that, that that that that weigh people down and just take them out of, focus and energy that they need to be productive.

Benjamin Mena [00:24:02]:
So how does one like, strengthen that emotional resilience?

Brad Wolff [00:24:08]:
There's there's a number of steps. One of them is to, to realize this is just part of the game and it's not it's not it's not just picking on you. It's not some personal thing. It's just part of the game. It's a statistics game. That's part of it. Also and there there's a number of things. I'll just say it on a few key ones.

Brad Wolff [00:24:28]:
Mhmm. Is to allow yourself to blow off steam. Okay? A lot of people don't know how to do that well. When I say blowing off steam, if something's really upsetting to you and you're just kinda like, okay. No. No. And just holding holding it and not not really allowing yourself to deal with it, that then all that negative energy is just stuck inside of you, and it's it it has nowhere to go. So blow it off steam, allow yourself 5 minutes.

Brad Wolff [00:24:56]:
And if you go somewhere where you can shout ex expletives, I've made up all kinds of bad words. I mean, stuff that I don't even know what it means, but it sounds really bad. Okay. Go up. But the thing is not to not to have it as, as something that causes negative interactions with other people. Okay? So I allow myself to and just say whatever. I may vent with someone and just say, if you were my coworker business partner, I would say, Benjamin, you know, would you have 5 minutes that I can bet? And what I'm gonna say has nothing to do with you. I just wanna talk about what happened.

Brad Wolff [00:25:32]:
You can I'm not mad at you. So when you see me all mad at you, you have nothing to do with this. And express what's going on and and and and share what's going on with the, you know, strong emotion, because I'm really upset. And you just realize that, Hey, I get it. Yeah. That that does suck. So that venting piece can really help. And you may need to vent a couple of times, a few times, but just no no never vent for more than 3 to 5 minutes at a time.

Brad Wolff [00:26:00]:
Because when you're when you go beyond that, you're not venting. You're just obsessing. And obsessing is one prompts because you just keep thinking about the same thing. So there's a there's a number of things that I teach, my clients, but you've you you can't just ignore and and dismiss away these upsets because you actually make them bigger when you resist them or deny them. Them. That's psychologically proven.

Benjamin Mena [00:26:26]:
Oh, because yeah, that's the one I've seen over the years myself. I've seen other people I really get sometimes derailed and it's hard getting yourself back on the rails. So, kind of jumping gun the gun a little bit. I wanna talk about procrastination. It's a, it's a thing a lot of recruiters deal with, even though they don't think they're dealing with it, but they deal with it. How do I, as a recruiter, stop procrastinating?

Brad Wolff [00:26:55]:
Yeah. Can we talk about that another time?

Benjamin Mena [00:26:59]:
I couldn't

Brad Wolff [00:26:59]:
resist that. So we all deal with procrastination at some point, and it's it's a bit misunderstood. It often a lot misunderstood, Benjamin. You see, we tell ourselves off that procrastination is laziness. It's not. No. That's not laziness. What it is is it's the natural avoidance of something that we are concerned about that we don't wanna do.

Brad Wolff [00:27:23]:
It's avoidance of emotional discomfort. And human beings, as human beings, we always wanna avoid emotional discomfort, and then we start building it into something bigger than it is. So so to realize number 1, I'm just I just don't wanna do this because there's something I'm concerned about. So that's step 1. Step 2, you wanna address what what it is that's concerning you. So you can really look at it objectively and realize that, hey, it's gonna cause more emotional upset and effort to avoid it than it is to do it. Let's, let's figure out what I could do to start taking some action to doing it. Because it's when you realize that the, you blew this up into something bigger than it really is and addressing what it is.

Brad Wolff [00:28:12]:
Hey. Someone said, you know, pick up the phone and call 20 people that you don't know. Well, most people wanna avoid it. Well, let's look at why I wanna avoid this. Okay? And maybe I wanna avoid it for a good reason because sometimes the procrastination is legitimate. So if my boss says when a when a candidate takes a counter offer, call him up and tell him, you'll never I'm never gonna work with you again, and we're gonna make sure that everyone knows, you know, blah blah blah blah blah. And then you're I don't know. I don't wanna do that.

Brad Wolff [00:28:46]:
Well, maybe it's a good idea that you don't do that because they've already they're not gonna take your job anyway. All you're gonna do now is create a negative vibe and a bad reputation for your partner, you.

Benjamin Mena [00:28:57]:
I feel like they used to work

Brad Wolff [00:28:58]:
look at why are you procrastinating. And and is it really a big legitimate deal, or is it something else? And but you you've gotta you've gotta look at look at it and realize it for what it is, which is really an avoidance of emotion and discomfort. But there's steps that you can do very specific and build the skills so that procrastination doesn't become this big monster. That's a habit. Every time you don't feel like doing something.

Benjamin Mena [00:29:22]:
Well, like it jumps to another question. So spin the morning planned out. I know what I'm going to do today. I know the jobs I'm going to target. I know that the people I'm going to try to go after, like, I am ready to rock and roll for the day. And by the time, like, I get done. And this is a story between me and many other people out there. I get it.

Benjamin Mena [00:29:42]:
We hit, I threw Kim and then I looked down at my list and I looked down at what I thought, what I've done. I'm like, I'm like, I felt like I started the day. Right. But how does it day keep on getting away from me? How do I, all these things keep on getting away from me?

Brad Wolff [00:29:56]:
You know what? That so that is so cool. And some of it has to do with the way you plan your day. Some of it has to do with by brain chemistry. So it look so I can address some of these things. Okay. So you're the the recruiting industry with what we talked about the challenges of recruiting industry, your day will get away from you if you're not intentional about taking control of your day. It's it's not it will. Right? So number 1, you want a very small to do list.

Brad Wolff [00:30:30]:
Study psychological studies of how the brain work has shown no more than 4 to 6 items. You see, when you got a big to do list, it's a constant distraction because you're you're always whether you're conscious of it or not or thinking about all that shit that you're never gonna get to. Or, oh my god. If even if I get this and this done, it's not even gonna matter. Alright. That's one problem of the big to do list. And at least a feeling overwhelmed and at least a disappointment. So you start getting, you start getting later in the day and you realize I done very little on my to do list, what's the point? It's it's a lost day.

Brad Wolff [00:31:05]:
Maybe tomorrow will be better. Okay. So so starting with a big to do list all automatically is a is put you in a at a likely to lose situation. Small to do this, I love. I feel good. I can prioritize it. You also wanna prioritize based on an importance, not just urgency. So those are 2 different things, but urgent and easy tends to get the attention above what's really matters most, which is submitting.

Brad Wolff [00:31:32]:
Ultimately, it's about submitting quality candidates that you can get interviews for. That's what this business is based on, but I don't wanna get too much into the fundamentals of the business. I wanna talk about productivity. Another element is to realize that our mind is freshest in the morning for biochemistry reasons. See, we the human brain functions on what are called neurotransmitters. These are chemicals that cause the allow the brain to function. In the morning, we have a higher amount of neurochemical. So as we go through the day, we're using them up and we restore them when we sleep, assuming we sleep well.

Brad Wolff [00:32:07]:
So if you're using them up during the day, the more the more difficult task should be done early in the day when you have a larger reserve of, neurotransmitters. What I might often refer to as cognitive fuel or mental energy. So when you try to do Okay. And then there's things you can do, but we can go on and on to conserve your cognitive fuel or mental energy. So you're not wasting on things that could have been used for more productive purposes.

Benjamin Mena [00:32:44]:
So the big takeaway is I need to cut down my to to to do list probably. Try to knock things out first thing in the morning or when I have, like, the most mental energy because, you

Brad Wolff [00:32:55]:
know, the more difficult tasks.

Benjamin Mena [00:32:56]:
The more difficult tasks.

Brad Wolff [00:32:57]:
The biggest problem with productivity is the most productive tasks. So they're usually the most difficult ones that take the most effort. Right? So you want to do them early when you're fresher, you have more content, more fun work.

Benjamin Mena [00:33:08]:
Oh, that is great.

Brad Wolff [00:33:10]:
And But the overwhelm will kill you. As soon as you feel overwhelmed, your mind, your mind goes into a stress state and a stress state shuts off the ability to think rationally. So that's another problem that we're dealing with with a big to do list and getting caught up in problems. As soon as overwhelm hits, you're done. You're feeling overwhelmed, you can't get shit done.

Benjamin Mena [00:33:30]:
Well, is there anything else that you wanna talk about before we jump to the next section when it comes to productivity with recruiting?

Brad Wolff [00:33:37]:
I'm a let you lead because you're doing such a good job.

Benjamin Mena [00:33:39]:
Well, I know that you, actually have a 15 recruiting productivity hacks that if you wanna check it out, it's gonna be in the show notes. So definitely check that out. Click the link. Can you give us like 1 or 2 of those hacks as like kind of a little bit of a teaser?

Brad Wolff [00:33:54]:
So what we we just talked about one of them, which is to start with, to do this. We we talked about a few of them, but there's there's 15 of them. I wanna keep selling reserve. So then so that people are excited when they see it, but it's it's a very practical tactics that people can put into action quickly and get the productivity improved. You know, it's it's productivity. There's more involved in productivity than just a hack here and and a tactic there, but it really gets things moving in the right direction where people can quickly make some improvements that can get them going in the right direction and improve the productivity. So that's the thing is people often think, oh, if I just did this and the the one of the common things, if I just had a a better planner or I just had a better to do list or I had better tools and technology. And tools and technology will not solve a productivity problem ever.

Benjamin Mena [00:34:50]:
I almost wanna say that sometimes tools and technology, like, makes it worse.

Brad Wolff [00:34:55]:
When I started off in recruiting and we had no tools and technology, we were manual. I was able to focus so much more. I'm telling it was, it was so much easier to focus. As we added tools and technology, it became more and more difficult for me to focus. We have more and more things to do, more and more things to learn, more and more things to troubleshoot. Tools and technology on one hand are important blessing that we need. On the other hand, they will not solve your productivity problems. They will create other ones, and they don't self execute.

Brad Wolff [00:35:27]:
No one's showing me a tool that self executes and does it for you.

Benjamin Mena [00:35:31]:
Yeah. It's you can easily get the shiny objects in them when it comes to tools in our space. You know, Hey, this is going to solve this. This is going to solve that. Next thing you know, you're $500 a month on another tool. And you're like, do I even need this?

Brad Wolff [00:35:45]:
It's the shiny object syndrome is so common and the answer isn't to be manual and just don't embrace technology either. That's that way.

Benjamin Mena [00:35:53]:
Okay, cool. So let's jump into the quick fire questions. So you've been a recruiter, You've trained recruiters. You've trained agency owners. So I love this asking you this question. What advice would you give to somebody that's just getting started in the recruiting industry in 2024?

Brad Wolff [00:36:12]:
First of all, you being a productive recruiter, you need to have the skills and the knowledge of recruiting. You can't be you can't be a productive recruiter if you don't have the skills and knowledge. So you really need to learn high quality skills in what you're doing and have adequate, at least adequate technology to perform your tests. So that's number 1. You can't put productivity your way out of knowledge and skills. The productivity piece has to do with implementing, executing the knowledge and skills, but you need this knowledge and skills. I mean, I'm not that that comes first.

Benjamin Mena [00:36:52]:
Okay. Well, what about this? Like, when you're coming to experienced recruiters, people that you've talked about 5, 10, 15, 2 decades in, almost 2 decades like myself. Crazy. What advice would you give to those recruiters to see success or stay successful?

Brad Wolff [00:37:10]:
With respect to productivity? Either way. Productivity or non productivity. Well, I would say if you really experience the problem you that I see frequently is the things that used to work we wanna hold on to. And what happens is the environment our environment changes fast, and it seems to change at a faster rate as time goes on. So the people with a lot of experience have usually not adapted as fast as the environment has changed. So they've fallen behind in terms of processes, tools, and solutions that, that are important to be successful now instead of successful back years ago. And they need to renew, reinvigorate, regenerate to be able to get back in the game and be highly competitive, in today's world. That's number one thing that I see with people that have been very successful over many years.

Benjamin Mena [00:38:08]:
Awesome. Do you have, like, a favorite book that's had a huge impact on your career?

Brad Wolff [00:38:15]:
Oh my gosh. There's been so many, one of them that I think of because it, it has productivity is called atomic hats. And And that's one thing I didn't hit on as much that maybe I should have, Benjamin, is at the end of the day, the key is to make things habits. Because if they're not a habit, you've got to reserve willpower and force, which is not sustainable. So you've got to develop little habits slash routines that you regularly, repetitively fire off that are helpful to you. And as you develop these habits, it becomes more automatic and less difficult because the habit of distractibility is the problem. So you need to develop a habit of nondistractability. So at the end of the day, until you incorporate things into habits, they're not sustainable, ongoing, efforts and that, that we implement.

Benjamin Mena [00:39:08]:
I love that you, atomic habits is the book because that's actually the we're recording right now in January. It's gonna go live later on, but that's the book of the month for the elite recruiter community is atomic habits. So we're all reading that right now. We're actually getting together to talk about that at the end of the month. So, and my God, that is now I know why it has so many reviews on audible and Amazon. It is a game changer of a book. So great recommendation, Brad.

Brad Wolff [00:39:34]:
Absolutely.

Benjamin Mena [00:39:35]:
Well, how about this? What's your thoughts on artificial intelligence and how it's going to impact recruiting?

Brad Wolff [00:39:42]:
Boy, that one we can talk forever. First of all, I'm gonna give a disclaimer. I have no faith that I can predict the future. Thing is I don't have faith other people can. It it almost never works out quite how the pundits think. Okay? What I, my sense though, Benjamin, is, and it's based on, you know, being alive for multiple years with

Benjamin Mena [00:40:04]:
new

Brad Wolff [00:40:05]:
and technologies coming out, is initially whether you're talking about the Internet, you're talking about social media, you're talking about software and automation. Initially, there's this big rush that, oh my gosh, this is gonna change everything. And, you know, I remember when online job boards were gonna put recruiters out of business. I remember when that, because that was gonna lead to, internal recruiting staffs that build all the jobs without the recruiter. But I I remember so many new things that come up. Computers were supposed to create mass unemployment years ago. That was why I feared. So initially there's this big over emphasis, overenthusiasm about this new thing.

Brad Wolff [00:40:50]:
That's going to change everything. And at the end of the day, it's overhyped. It's gonna change things, but not as fast or quite in the way that we think. It never does, in my opinion, based on history. But here's the thing in the recruiting industry. Ultimately, I don't care what technology you have. There's judgment relationships. You're not gonna replace judgment and relationships at this point.

Brad Wolff [00:41:16]:
And the relationship part, the skill in being able to truly connect and relate with another human being that you can have influence that moves things forward and gives you a competitive edge is not AI to way at this point. No. We'll have avatars and we'll be able to plug in the, the right connection personality for that target audience someday down the road. It's not gonna be the next year or 2. I can pretty much give you that assurance. So that's awesome. As Forrest Gump was, that's about all I gotta say about AI.

Benjamin Mena [00:41:47]:
Do you have a favorite? I normally say recruiting tech tool, but I'm going to make a productivity. Do you have a favorite productivity tool that you love?

Brad Wolff [00:41:57]:
No, because I don't think it works out. It's not so much tools. It's ways of approaching. It's mindsets and beliefs. It's habits. It's ways of approaching things. That's part of the problem with productivity is people are looking for some magic tool. So, yeah, I'm gonna say that's the problem is you're looking for something that is not gonna do it.

Brad Wolff [00:42:20]:
It's it starts with how you your beliefs, your mindsets and beliefs set a pattern. And we have mindsets and beliefs that are built on foundations of myths and stuff that maybe was true in the past, but isn't now. So that you're not gonna have a tool that's gonna do it in my business.

Benjamin Mena [00:42:34]:
So no tool and not working on the

Brad Wolff [00:42:36]:
Chat TPT. Okay. I'm gonna confess. Chat TPT. If you just use chat TPT, forget about it. You're full.

Benjamin Mena [00:42:44]:
Yeah. Awesome. Oh, man. I've I have way too much fun with ChatTPT.

Brad Wolff [00:42:48]:
I think you hit the nail on the head. It's it's a lot of fun. I mean, that's layers of stuff that we less less less for another episode.

Benjamin Mena [00:42:56]:
Sounds good. What do you think has been a huge part of your own personal success?

Brad Wolff [00:43:01]:
That's a great question. I think the biggest thing is that I always I always wanna learn and improve. No matter what happens, how can I get back? I re reflect constantly. What did I do here? What what did I do that didn't work? What can I do differently now? I'm always looking to problem solve, prevent problems. I'm big on problem prevention. So it's constantly always trying to learn and improve and prevent because whenever something didn't go right, well, what could I have done differently? What will I do differently next time? So I'm always looking to improve and develop new tools and processes and solutions to problems that occur in the industry. So I think that's one of the biggest thing is I never, I never give up wanting to, to get better, to learn more and to improve.

Benjamin Mena [00:43:47]:
That's awesome. And that's one thing I love about the atomic habits book that we're, that we're reading in the book club is it really talks about processes and systems. And like you just said, it's a big thing with a lot of top pillars. It's they, whether they know it or not, they've built out these systems and processes that they just live their life with.

Brad Wolff [00:44:06]:
And what do you call a system or process that you regularly do? There's a lot of it. You know what? Give me your address. I'm gonna send you a check when we get offline. I'll I'm gonna send you I'm gonna send you an autograph copy of atomic happens. How's that? I'm gonna autograph it for you.

Benjamin Mena [00:44:22]:
Perfect. And here's here's actually, you know, this is actually my favorite question and this is how we typically wrap up the podcast. If you can, everything that, you know, now, everything that you've experienced with the ups and downs of your career, the wins, the losses, if you could sit down with yourself and have a cup of coffee with young Brad, what would you tell yourself?

Brad Wolff [00:44:48]:
First thing I would say is pull your head out of your butt, young man. I would start with that because it can get buried up there where we start buying our own press and thinking that we're so smart and we got the solutions and whatever we learned is is gonna work and it'll keep working. So that's a lot of it. That's number 1 is to don't don't buy into that. And I just I refer to that generically as having my head on my butt. And that I that I think is that simple.

Benjamin Mena [00:45:13]:
And why is that? Like, why why that advice?

Brad Wolff [00:45:17]:
Because I think that the world is so fluid and dynamic and that you've never really even if you had the answer to something now, it's gonna change. Whatever you're doing that works now will not continue to work in the same way in the future. Okay. So stop buying into that. You have this magic solution. Oh, and if I know how to use AI and I know how to do it, and if I only had this tool and that tool, I bought into that for years that there's this magic solution that if, or once I learned how to do this well, I'm golden. Well, whatever you do, I see that all the time. LinkedIn came out.

Brad Wolff [00:45:52]:
People started using LinkedIn and this and that and using, you know, automation and this and that, and that's, you know, everyone's using it and that it just becomes a bigger problem where you're just another commodity out there that's bothering them. I remember back in the early 2000 that we could send our company, we could send a mass email to client prospects that we didn't even know. And I wouldn't get a lot of new job orders because they would email back. Oh my god. Yeah. How can you help us with this? I mean, do that now and tell me how it works. Okay. So whatever works will not keep working.

Brad Wolff [00:46:26]:
You better adapt. It's all about being able to learn and adapt quickly and then keep adapting because whatever you do won't work. So that's what I mean about the head up the butt is to think that the world works, whatever you can you can have some tool or solution and it's gonna keep working. It's more about adapting, learning, and adapting quickly as opposed to that you have something that's gonna work. And if it keeps working, the biggest problem is you wanna keep doing it and never give up doing it because, well, it still works, but and then we just come up with all these explanations on why it doesn't work when the reality is, no. It doesn't work. The market's changed. These people are tired of this bullshit and they, they don't respond anymore.

Benjamin Mena [00:47:06]:
That's right. I'm just imagining a world where you could send out a mass email and I get tons of job orders And that, and nowadays, like, you know, I've, I have friends that are hiring managers and they're like, I think one of them a few weeks ago is like, I have had, I think it was like 170 messages so far this month for recruiting services.

Brad Wolff [00:47:30]:
That's what I'm saying. But it used to work. That's so that's why I said young man, get your head out of your butt is because I had a false model of the world that you could have a solution and then ride that solution. I mean, it's true in every field, the medical field, whatever. It's always the case. Whatever advice they say, you need to do this, this, and this. Down the road, they say, well, we've learned that we were wrong. You need to take this supplement.

Brad Wolff [00:47:49]:
No. Actually, we have adverse it's inevitable. Don't buy in that you've got the solution that you can just take to the bank and keep on printing money. It just doesn't work that way.

Benjamin Mena [00:48:00]:
I love that.

Brad Wolff [00:48:01]:
Now the film the fundamentals tend to be stable, but their strategies and tactics to execute the fundamentals are constantly changing. Because your audience keeps adapting and

Benjamin Mena [00:48:11]:
if you

Brad Wolff [00:48:12]:
they don't they don't respond the same way to these things that they did. That is so true.

Benjamin Mena [00:48:17]:
Well, Brad, for the listeners, if they wanna connect with you or follow you, how do they do that?

Brad Wolff [00:48:23]:
Okay. You can connect with me on LinkedIn.

Benjamin Mena [00:48:26]:
Okay.

Brad Wolff [00:48:26]:
My name is Brad, w o l f f. It's just like the big Brad Wolf. And do you wanna give my email address?

Benjamin Mena [00:48:35]:
Yeah. Yeah. I'll put I'll have your LinkedIn in the show notes.

Brad Wolff [00:48:37]:
That's email or LinkedIn. And Don't call me because I block out time and I'm not answering my phone for

Benjamin Mena [00:48:43]:
Well, there we go. There's a there's a tip before we end. Well, Brad, before I let you go, is there anything else that you would love to share with the listeners?

Brad Wolff [00:48:50]:
Really that I love this recruiting community. I know how challenging it is and how much things change and how much more difficult it is than most people from the outside think. And I have a tremendous amount of understanding and empathy for how difficult it is to really be productive and not kill yourself with the grind and the hours and the stress. So the good news is there are ways there are solutions that can really make a big difference that you can produce a lot more work, less, and not be stressed out and overwhelmed all the time.

Benjamin Mena [00:49:29]:
Oh, that is the recruiting dream, making more, stressing less and working less. There we go. Well, listen Hey,

Brad Wolff [00:49:37]:
I can put that in a tool that I can sell, but Chatty just look at them in ChattyPT. You'll have your answer. Otherwise very good. Ask this question. They'll give you the answer.

Benjamin Mena [00:49:47]:
No. But, Brad, I'm excited that you came onto the podcast. Like I said, one of the, like, when we started off, one of the biggest things that I've seen with, you know, my journey in recruiting and other people's journey in recruiting is just so often you get to the end of the day and you're just like, what did I get done? Wait, what have I, where have we gone? Who have I gotten hold of? It's just like the day days can easily turn chaotic and chaotic days means you're producing less.

Brad Wolff [00:50:12]:
Natural order of everything in life is what's called entropy, which is to move to a degree of a greater disorder and chaos. A garden will naturally have weeds. You don't have to plant them. We will naturally get off track, go off on tangents, get distracted, do the things that are easy and fun rather than things that are harder and more productive. So the reality is that it we will naturally move in a direction that doesn't support our success until we develop the success habits that we that move it

Benjamin Mena [00:50:43]:
forward. Yeah. So true. Well, Brad, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. For the listeners, let's make this your best year yet, and let's also make this your most productive year yet. So let's crush it, guys.

Intro [00:50:54]:
Thanks for listening to this episode of the elite recruiter podcast with Benjamin Menna. If you enjoyed, hit subscribe and leave a rating.